Everyday Trauma You Never Knew You Had

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Welcome to Why Is It So, your last defence for common sense,

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with your co-hosts Paul Zammett and Vince Locizzano.

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Welcome to Why Is It So. I'm your host, Paul Zammett, and today we are talking

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about a mental health problem we all think we understand.

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But beyond the basics, we will hear some unexpected truths about trauma.

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But what if trauma is not always about war zones, car crashes or major disasters?

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What if it's the subtle everyday moments that leave lasting emotional scanners?

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Joining me today is Laura Giles, a seasoned trauma therapist and educator who

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has spent years helping people uncover and heal from the kind of traumas they

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don't even know they had.

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If you've ever wondered why you react the way you do, or why certain patterns

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keep showing up in your life, this episode is going to open your eyes in ways you did not expect.

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So, let me introduce you to Laura. Good evening, Laura, and thank you for giving

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us your time to tell us a little bit about trauma and exactly what it is. Oh.

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Exactly what is trauma apart from getting a hit on the head or a war or whatever?

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It's a good question because I think a lot of people really don't know.

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The way that I look at it as it's something that overcomes your nervous system

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and impairs your ability to function.

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So it's really not about how extreme

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it is like it doesn't have to be war it doesn't have to be a

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blow to the head it doesn't have to be something that's

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just you know something that we'd all agree upon that it's horrible it could

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be a bunch of little things over time and I think people underestimate how powerful

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these little things are because it's not about what happens to us It's about

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feeling alone with what happens to us.

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And that aloneness is what allows us to feel like helpless and there's nothing that we can do.

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It makes us feel like we can't bounce back. Can someone just go through trauma

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and not even know they've got it? Like it's real like a bad day.

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So most of my clients have trauma and didn't realize.

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Lots of people get divorced and that's a traumatizing experience.

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Lots of people experience betrayal. that's a

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traumatizing experience I'm not saying that it would be that for everybody but

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if you feel alone with it and yes it is lots of people get really depressed

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they lose lots of weight they lose their friends you know the friend goes with

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the other spouse they lose their their livelihood or you know a lot of their income

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It's a very traumatic experience, and it's a very common one.

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And because it's common, we think, well, this is just life. You just get over

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it. Normally, you associate with a trauma.

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In my case, to me, trauma was a physical thing.

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This is more an emotional trauma. You can have an emotional trauma,

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from what I understand. Well, trauma is actually holistic.

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So, yes, it is emotional. You might be crying all the time. You might not be

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crying all the time. It's physical. It affects your brain.

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It affects the way that your brain works. So I was just having a conversation

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with somebody today who was asking me, you know, why are people so irrational?

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Why can't you just see? You know, this is so easy. Why can't they just understand?

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And it's because trauma changes your brain. It changes the way that you see things.

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It changes the way that you relate to people. So you do become irrational.

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This front part of your brain goes offline. The back part is now controlling things.

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And this is the emotional part. This is the survival part.

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The survival parts are not thinking long-term.

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They're not thinking about strategies and, you know, niceties.

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It's worried about survival. So, of course, that person is going to be emotionally motivated.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just talk about intergenerational trauma.

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So, how can something that happened to our ancestors still affect us today?

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Is that possible? Oh, absolutely.

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So, let's say that my family survived a famine.

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Okay, so three generations back there was a famine. I wasn't even thought of at the time.

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Okay, so a bunch of people survived this thing, and it changed the way that

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their brains were, and now they're not functioning as well as they can.

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They have babies, and now this impacts the way that they're parenting.

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So it impacts the nutrients that are available, the stress hormones, cortisol, all of this.

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So all their babies are now incubated in all that stress.

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They're born prone to stress, prone to obesity, prone to disease,

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and they have now my generation.

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So I came here fresh out. I haven't done a thing, and I'm already traumatized.

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Yes, that absolutely happens.

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So how do they recognize this? How does someone recognize the fact that they've got trauma?

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I mean, they could go for their whole life and not sort of even register that there could be a trauma.

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That's right. Yeah. I assume everybody has it. It's just to what degree.

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I mean, because I'm in this 24-7, day in and day out, I see things that are

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traumatizing in everyday life.

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You know, you watch a movie on HBO, in the first 15 minutes,

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you're going to see some real graphic sex and violence.

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If you came from a culture that didn't have that, that would be like,

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oh, but we're so numb to that because we see it every day, all day long.

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We aren't registering the trauma.

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So there's all different kinds of traumatizing things, like the murder of the

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Ukrainian girl, like the murder of Charlie Kirk.

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All over the Internet, who did not see that?

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People were killed right in

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front of your eyes, and we're just watching that like it's just nothing.

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That's trauma. We should be shocked by that. So, okay, we now call,

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well, to me, I now call it trauma.

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Now I understand what we're talking about.

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What did we used to call it before everyone took it up as a trauma?

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I mean, as things that happened to you or, you know, sort of,

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as we just said, you see someone killed in front of your eyes and whatever have you.

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Did we take it as trauma before or did we just sort of say, oh, God,

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My head's not right for what happened. Well, so before 1980,

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we didn't have a diagnosis for it in the mental health community, which is shocking.

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You think, you know, hasn't this been going on before? Yes. But the medical

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community really didn't understand it.

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And since the 1980s, the research and the technology has been absolutely astounding.

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So I've been in the field since around 2000.

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And just the the innovations that have happened since then are mind-boggling part of what it is

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has what you were talking about that's it's the intergenerational

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trauma and the studies on there's a word for that where they study the generational

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how things turn up in your in your i can't think of the word i'm sorry but that's

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a thing and we have science for that now so it's been legitimized and now we

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can talk about it and label it but yeah it was always here before Yeah, I suppose,

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I've just thought of it.

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People used to, in those days when we didn't have anything for a trauma,

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didn't realize it was a trauma, we had a therapist.

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Everyone went to their therapist and talk it out, and that, I suppose,

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is what they do now with the trauma.

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Well, talk therapy is a very small component of it. Yes.

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So the part of the brain that is damaged is actually, it's much older than the

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prefrontal cortex, which has the language.

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So if you're just using this to overcome trauma, it's not going to happen.

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That's not where it lives and talking about it's not going to do anything.

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So the talking about it becomes important when you're trying to integrate and

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you want to, so after everything has happened and you want to kind of put the

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pieces back together, you can talk about it feel seen to feel heard to validate

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those kinds of things but.

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The treating of it really doesn't have anything to do with talking. Right, right.

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Well, this is what I had here. If you're doing any work, what some surprising

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ways of trauma can show up in the body, especially for people who don't think

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that they have any mental health?

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Well, so if you're angry all the time, if you're grouchy. Sounds like me.

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Yeah, if you're grouchy all the time, you've got problems. It might not be trauma.

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There could be some health problems.

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High blood pressure can do that, but it could be trauma.

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If you are just, because one of the ways that it manifests is I just don't trust

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people. I don't like people. I don't want to be around you.

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And if you talk to me, I'm just going to give you some bad attitude because

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that's my way of protecting myself.

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Right, right, right. So you might not think you have a problem,

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but if you're grouchy and angry all the time, it could be trauma.

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Okay. Now I've found that I've got a problem.

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And being grumpy and all that sort of thing. I always thought,

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well, you know, something happens during the day and I'm happy and I forget about that part of it.

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What would I do and how would I sort of contact someone? Who would I know who

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to go to to sort of help me with the trauma?

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So there's lots of directories. I don't know if I'll have Psychology Today down

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there, but that's the big one here. Yes, I'm sorry, what was it?

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Psychology Today. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

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Okay. that's a good start and i would look specifically for

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someone who is trauma trained so you

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have this term called trauma informed and i

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think that's the only like click thing that you can

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do in psychology today trauma informed is not the same as trauma trained so

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hopefully we're all trauma informed now doctors nurses anybody who works with

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people emts therapists and that really just means I can spot trauma when I see

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it. That doesn't mean I can treat it.

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So you want somebody who can treat trauma.

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A real good book, it's kind of become the Bible, is The Body Keeps the Score.

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And in that book, Bessel van der Kolk talks about all the useful therapies for

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trauma, the things that actually work, which talk therapy is not really one of them.

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And those are going to be things like neurofeedback, EMDR, hypnosis.

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You want somebody who's trained in those modalities because they work. Ah, right. Okay.

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Yeah. Why do some people seem to come out of trauma stronger than others,

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stay in the survival mode for years and then do nothing about it and suddenly it comes up?

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I think community has a huge piece

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to that. And community and a sense of belonging gives you resilience.

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So if I go through something and it's horrible, like a shared experience.

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So what is that guy's name? The guy that wrote Tribe, Sebastian Younger,

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wrote a book about how people connect and have a tribe.

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And one of his examples was in World War II, you know, you're in London,

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you're getting bombed all the time. And yet these people didn't really have

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trauma because they had each other.

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And they leaned on each other. They went through it together.

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They had good times. They laughed. And so they were able to bounce back.

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The same is true for lots of people in the military. When you're in a tight

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unit and you are just so close, that feels safer than the real world to some

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people. Because you've got someone to help you.

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And you lean on, as you say, lean on them if you've got a problem.

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Yes. You talk about it within the group.

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Absolutely. And that sort of obviously helps you, saying. Yes. Ah, excellent.

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What's a trauma myth that you really wish you could retire for good?

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So it's not as much a myth now, but when I first started in mental health,

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there was this idea that you can't ever recover from it.

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And I had soldiers curse me out for that.

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They said I was insensitive. How dare you? I'm never going to get rid of this.

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You know you can't be saying that to people you're giving people false hope,

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but as long as i've been in the field they have been

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effective treatments and we don't really say that anymore so i hope that that's

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something that's moving outside the the people's thoughts yeah because you can

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absolutely treat trauma i say so basically you're blamed for trying to treat Is that right? Yes.

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Uh-huh. Yeah. Here's a controversial one. Can therapy sometimes make trauma

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worse if it's not handled the right way?

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Yes. I hate to say that people in the profession can make it worse,

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but I think we have to talk about medical trauma because in a lot of,

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I consider mental health medical, you know, health is holistic,

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but in a lot of settings, people are not compassionate. They're not understanding.

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And one of the things that draws people to mental health is their own trauma.

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So there are a lot of sick people who are providers not saying that that makes

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them not good helpers But it can And I know that when I was going through grad school,

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we did lots of group projects So you knew everybody's business and you know

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all of that and there were a lot of people I was like you Should not be here

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and there's no gatekeeping So if you earn your degree and if you check your boxes,

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you're now able to practice and there were a lot of unstable people that I went

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to school with, and I mean, I don't know what the field looks like, but,

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yeah, I think you can be hurt by your therapist.

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Okay. Well, how do I know the person that I'm seeing can do what he or she is saying that they can do?

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That's a good question, you know,

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because we don't have, it's not like a restaurant where you get reviews.

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You're not supposed to ask for reviews, and because of HIPAA,

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You know, you're not supposed to, everything is just hush hush.

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You don't talk about your clients. Your clients don't talk about you.

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And I don't, I guess you could ask around, ask people, who do you go to? Who do you like?

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But that's not a guarantee either because I've certainly had lots of referrals.

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And, you know, you don't click the same with those people. It doesn't mean you're

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not a good therapist. It just means it's not a good fit. Yeah. So...

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So it's a try and sort of, you know, if it doesn't work, go somewhere else?

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Absolutely, yeah. It could do more damage, though, can't it?

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It sort of go to one person, they say, uh-uh, you're okay, and you're weighing

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you sort of just as bad as you were before.

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Doesn't that sort of stop you from looking for somebody else?

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I'd go, oh, these people don't know what they're doing, sort of thing, you know?

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I think, yeah, it could get to that. But I recently had a client who came in,

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and her therapist dismissed her, and she wasn't really sure why.

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And, well, she said it was because she wasn't getting any better.

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Things weren't moving along. And I think that was actually a good call,

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because if she's not doing her any benefit, then she shouldn't be there.

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But I think maybe the way that it was handled was not sensitive,

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because she was very crushed by that.

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And she was totally scared to talk to anybody else, you know.

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And when we did hit it off and work together, she has been so grateful ever

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since because of the way that she left with her last therapist.

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And I think that kind of still hurts her now.

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I'm a bit of a skeptic, I might add, on top of my grumpiness.

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In your business, you would have a lot of myths floating around about what can

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or what can't be done or how to do it and when not to do it.

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What is one myth about trauma that you really wish you could just get rid of

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it altogether, retire it?

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What myth? Yeah. Okay.

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That's drugs help. Drugs? Yeah.

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Yeah. I'm not saying that drugs don't help, but for a lot of people,

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that's the solution, especially for community mental health.

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They just give you drugs and help you to be stable so you're not in the psych

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hospital, which is really expensive.

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But you're not really being cured.

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And I think some people think, well, I just need some meds. It'll be okay.

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And then they don't really want wellness.

00:16:45.718 --> 00:16:47.738
And wellness is... Sorry, sorry.

00:16:48.858 --> 00:16:52.798
Wellness is available. I don't think that you can just numb yourself out.

00:16:53.198 --> 00:16:57.978
I hope that people want more than that. Are you talking like prescribed drugs?

00:16:58.198 --> 00:17:01.738
I thought you were talking about illegal drugs. Prescription drugs, yeah. Okay.

00:17:02.678 --> 00:17:07.058
So we don't know whether it does work or it doesn't work. Is that what you're saying?

00:17:07.778 --> 00:17:12.658
I'm saying that I hope that people don't think that's all they need.

00:17:13.398 --> 00:17:16.338
Yeah, they don't realize. They just sort of, you go to your GP,

00:17:16.478 --> 00:17:20.378
they give you something like the one they have to settle you down, Valium.

00:17:21.038 --> 00:17:24.298
Yes, yes. It keeps them quiet. Right.

00:17:24.318 --> 00:17:27.278
They think, oh, everything's okay, but in fact it hasn't been cured.

00:17:27.278 --> 00:17:29.918
But it's just been sort of put aside.

00:17:30.398 --> 00:17:34.498
Right. And that can keep you from actually getting the help that you need.

00:17:35.018 --> 00:17:38.498
Yeah. Yeah, because you're not looking for it anymore. Yeah. Yeah. Right.

00:17:39.218 --> 00:17:41.318
It's like good enough, so I'm going to leave it alone.

00:17:42.126 --> 00:17:46.686
Most people associate trauma with huge events, accidents, abusive war,

00:17:46.746 --> 00:17:51.586
but can something as small as being ignored or dismissed,

00:17:51.866 --> 00:17:58.006
something childish thing, come up and be just as traumatic for someone?

00:17:58.566 --> 00:18:01.846
Yes. So a lot of my clients have that.

00:18:01.966 --> 00:18:06.706
I don't have typically the person who was beaten as a child and,

00:18:06.706 --> 00:18:10.126
you know, I don't know, the horrible things that happen to little kids.

00:18:10.206 --> 00:18:11.666
I don't have those clients typically.

00:18:12.126 --> 00:18:18.046
I have the ones that were ignored. I have the ones that, like in the movie Coraline,

00:18:18.186 --> 00:18:23.406
where your parents are just so busy and you're there all day alone and nobody's talking to you.

00:18:23.506 --> 00:18:28.606
Nobody's doing anything with you. Nobody's looking at you. You know, we need eye contact.

00:18:29.066 --> 00:18:32.286
It's a very small thing, but it's a very necessary thing.

00:18:32.426 --> 00:18:34.046
We need somebody to look at us

00:18:34.046 --> 00:18:37.726
with approval and love and let us know that we're good and we're valued.

00:18:37.726 --> 00:18:43.966
And if you grow up with a babysitter or in daycare and you see strangers all

00:18:43.966 --> 00:18:47.106
day long, strangers at school, strangers at daycare, you eat,

00:18:47.206 --> 00:18:51.906
you go to sleep, and that's it, you don't have any nurturing,

00:18:52.246 --> 00:18:54.226
that's not enough. No.

00:18:54.646 --> 00:18:58.126
That's not enough. Your nervous system will not develop normally.

00:18:59.126 --> 00:19:03.626
Okay. So that's in the family. But what about in your workplace?

00:19:04.286 --> 00:19:05.506
Same. Same thing happens.

00:19:06.186 --> 00:19:12.706
Yes. A lot of people, they say, yes, they say we have toxic workplaces, toxic bosses.

00:19:13.066 --> 00:19:17.386
I have had a lot of people on the verge of mental breakdowns.

00:19:17.446 --> 00:19:21.506
Like I need to go to the psych hospital because my workplace is so toxic.

00:19:22.066 --> 00:19:27.106
Lots and lots of people. So when you have toxic people or maybe you're one of

00:19:27.106 --> 00:19:30.426
them, you're the one and you're making life miserable for other people.

00:19:30.606 --> 00:19:34.306
It doesn't just stay in your little bubble. You infect other people with you.

00:19:34.866 --> 00:19:39.346
So I think it's just so important because we are social creatures.

00:19:39.346 --> 00:19:43.806
It's not like you're the only one that is impacted by your illness.

00:19:44.006 --> 00:19:49.066
So it could happen at home and then get double trouble if it happens to you

00:19:49.066 --> 00:19:51.186
in the workplace as well. Absolutely.

00:19:51.446 --> 00:19:53.666
That in itself would have to be traumatic. Yes.

00:19:54.166 --> 00:20:00.446
And so I don't get the loving at home. I don't get the same loving at work.

00:20:01.013 --> 00:20:05.733
It seems to be like, hey, no one wants me, so I'm on the scrap heap. Is that it?

00:20:06.033 --> 00:20:09.173
Yes. Does this happen a lot? I think so, yes.

00:20:09.433 --> 00:20:12.133
I mean, it's hard for me to say because this is what I do all day.

00:20:12.133 --> 00:20:15.493
So everybody I see, you know, yes, it happens to them. But I don't know how

00:20:15.493 --> 00:20:17.313
general it is to the population.

00:20:19.213 --> 00:20:26.633
That's fair enough. When it comes to healing, is trauma more about the mind or the body? It's both.

00:20:26.973 --> 00:20:32.613
It's really both. A lot of my clients have complex PTSD, and they also have

00:20:32.613 --> 00:20:35.053
autoimmune conditions. So they go hand in hand.

00:20:35.333 --> 00:20:41.433
The gut and the brain work together. So if the gut is not healthy,

00:20:41.593 --> 00:20:46.153
then it's not making neurotransmitters that the brain uses to help regulate our emotions.

00:20:46.473 --> 00:20:50.393
And if somebody has trauma, your gut's not working well.

00:20:50.533 --> 00:20:54.513
It's definitely impaired. And you might think, well, I got a cast iron stomach.

00:20:54.653 --> 00:20:55.833
I can eat whatever I want.

00:20:56.233 --> 00:21:00.493
Yeah, do some blood work and you'll find out. It's not working like you think it is.

00:21:00.673 --> 00:21:03.833
So yes, it is absolutely a mind-body thing.

00:21:03.953 --> 00:21:08.393
And there are lots of mind-body things you can do to help yourself,

00:21:08.493 --> 00:21:13.573
like yoga and Qigong, the things that you eat, the herbs that you take,

00:21:13.873 --> 00:21:16.573
those kinds of things, spending time outside in nature.

00:21:16.813 --> 00:21:20.293
So the more natural that you are, the more healthy you're going to be.

00:21:20.933 --> 00:21:25.233
Why do some people grow stronger after trauma while others just feel stuck there

00:21:25.233 --> 00:21:28.153
for years? So we call that post-traumatic resilience.

00:21:28.653 --> 00:21:36.033
And it has to do with the support that you have and the way that you are thinking about what happened.

00:21:36.253 --> 00:21:41.433
So in every hero story, the hero has to do something heroic.

00:21:41.773 --> 00:21:43.393
Otherwise, he's not a hero.

00:21:43.793 --> 00:21:47.113
I mean, you know, you've got to slay the dragon. You've got to save the world.

00:21:47.293 --> 00:21:49.693
You have to, you know, or maybe it's just a little personal.

00:21:50.293 --> 00:21:53.513
Act of defiance or something, but you have to do something hard.

00:21:53.753 --> 00:21:58.733
And when you frame that hard thing as the making of you and a blessing of you,

00:21:58.913 --> 00:21:59.873
now you have resilience.

00:21:59.973 --> 00:22:03.193
And if you're framing that thing as a thing that is killing you,

00:22:03.293 --> 00:22:05.573
that is breaking you, that's not resilience.

00:22:05.813 --> 00:22:11.333
So I don't think the person who says that this thing is crushing me has actually

00:22:11.333 --> 00:22:12.513
done the healing work yet.

00:22:12.995 --> 00:22:17.055
What's the most surprising thing you've ever learned about trauma that most

00:22:17.055 --> 00:22:19.895
professionals miss? There are so many.

00:22:20.155 --> 00:22:23.915
You know, I learned so much from my clients because they're living it,

00:22:24.055 --> 00:22:27.355
you know, and there are little tells.

00:22:27.915 --> 00:22:34.555
So one of the things that I've come up upon recently is the statistic that 85%

00:22:34.555 --> 00:22:40.875
of childhood sexual abuse victims are victimized at home by their parents.

00:22:41.015 --> 00:22:46.115
Could be the siblings. typically it's the parents, 85%. And we're out here looking

00:22:46.115 --> 00:22:50.015
for boogeymen hiding in bushes. It's not them. It's us.

00:22:50.455 --> 00:22:56.815
Yes. Oh, until we start talking about us and how we are dealing with our own

00:22:56.815 --> 00:23:00.535
family members, the problem's going to remain rampant.

00:23:00.735 --> 00:23:05.735
And that would be pretty hard to sort of, even in today's world.

00:23:06.015 --> 00:23:10.335
Years ago, no one spoke about it, especially for someone close to the family,

00:23:10.335 --> 00:23:14.695
not only the family members, such as religious people and whatever have you.

00:23:15.155 --> 00:23:21.595
Now, would they be able to sort of still speak out without being told that it

00:23:21.595 --> 00:23:27.235
was their fault, or even worse, be told that the children are just lying?

00:23:27.635 --> 00:23:33.815
It's the same as rape with women, where they don't say anything because they're

00:23:33.815 --> 00:23:38.095
worried that everybody's going to say, oh, it's your fault you had a short dress

00:23:38.095 --> 00:23:40.135
on or you did something else.

00:23:40.295 --> 00:23:45.635
And so they don't actually report it, whereas you expect they would.

00:23:46.035 --> 00:23:50.835
Well, when it's children, they generally don't anyway because they're scared.

00:23:51.755 --> 00:23:58.395
And I think we do need to talk about this because it's us, because it is our fault.

00:23:58.755 --> 00:24:03.115
And, well, I'll say this. I don't want to blame. I'll say it's our responsibility.

00:24:03.115 --> 00:24:06.375
If I am molesting my child, that's me.

00:24:06.615 --> 00:24:10.575
I'm the problem. I need the help. And here's the thing.

00:24:10.735 --> 00:24:14.155
You're talking about things that you don't know, things that professionals don't know.

00:24:14.155 --> 00:24:16.955
There's so in trauma we say that there's

00:24:16.955 --> 00:24:19.935
four different ways that people respond

00:24:19.935 --> 00:24:22.735
to trauma there's fight so let me just beat

00:24:22.735 --> 00:24:25.535
you up or overpower you there's flight get me out

00:24:25.535 --> 00:24:29.595
of here there's freeze and that's just like and fawn

00:24:29.595 --> 00:24:33.835
is like i'm gonna just make nice and then hopefully you'll i'll be so nice that

00:24:33.835 --> 00:24:38.495
you won't attack me but they're kind of redoing those those four f's so there's

00:24:38.495 --> 00:24:43.895
still fight there's still flight and there's food and there's sex with an f

00:24:43.895 --> 00:24:49.255
And so one of the things that so tons of of food addiction,

00:24:49.635 --> 00:24:53.015
there's tons of sex addiction. So we can see that this is true.

00:24:53.035 --> 00:24:57.815
But one of the things one of the ways that people cope is through sex.

00:24:57.935 --> 00:25:01.615
And if they don't have an outlet, there's your little kid.

00:25:02.580 --> 00:25:07.880
That's my outlet. So I think we need to start framing these things the way that they are.

00:25:08.020 --> 00:25:11.220
If the child is available, that's what's going to happen.

00:25:11.500 --> 00:25:14.620
It's not like people go out praying on other people's kids.

00:25:14.860 --> 00:25:19.120
They pray on their own kids. So we need to look at the truth of this thing and

00:25:19.120 --> 00:25:25.000
look at it the way that it is and deal with it based upon these facts. Yeah, yeah.

00:25:25.420 --> 00:25:31.540
Do you get a lot of that side of trauma in your overall practice?

00:25:31.540 --> 00:25:36.560
Not now, but I used to work in a prison as the sex offender treatment provider.

00:25:36.800 --> 00:25:42.680
So, yes, and that's pretty much what we saw. It was there was one one victim

00:25:42.680 --> 00:25:46.640
and it was just, you know, this is exactly what I said.

00:25:47.020 --> 00:25:52.060
This is I am lonely. I need somebody. This is my way of dealing with my problem.

00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:58.300
And they weren't out there just getting all the kids at random. It was usually one kid.

00:25:58.920 --> 00:26:02.980
And these people were traumatized. And it was their child?

00:26:03.260 --> 00:26:08.700
In some cases, yes. In some cases, no. So it could be like a babysitter situation

00:26:08.700 --> 00:26:13.640
or something like, usually it wasn't like, I'm just going to pick up somebody

00:26:13.640 --> 00:26:14.960
I'd never even seen before.

00:26:15.160 --> 00:26:18.420
They had some kind of relationship with, it was a teacher, it was a babysitter,

00:26:18.520 --> 00:26:21.120
a neighbor, a family member, like that.

00:26:21.360 --> 00:26:27.760
So tell me one story that you've had recently that you thought is a typical trauma.

00:26:28.040 --> 00:26:32.140
Oh, I don't know if there is a typical trauma. I think if there's typical trauma,

00:26:32.360 --> 00:26:35.280
it's just going to be the whole, I was neglected.

00:26:35.880 --> 00:26:40.600
That's the typical trauma. This is the person who is like, I don't know what's wrong with me.

00:26:40.620 --> 00:26:44.460
I have everything. I don't have any reason to be unhappy. I'm just so...

00:26:45.116 --> 00:26:49.256
Empty inside and I don't know why. And that's kind of the saddest thing.

00:26:49.336 --> 00:26:51.056
It makes sense if you got hit by a car.

00:26:51.156 --> 00:26:56.316
It makes sense if your spouse beat up on you. It makes sense if something really horrible happened.

00:26:56.456 --> 00:27:00.456
But when you just feel horrible and don't know why, it's probably because of trauma.

00:27:00.756 --> 00:27:04.176
So, okay, if I came to you and said, okay, I've got a problem.

00:27:04.356 --> 00:27:07.236
I think I've got trauma or I'm worried about something.

00:27:07.456 --> 00:27:11.936
What would you suggest apart from seeing you as a therapist?

00:27:12.296 --> 00:27:13.836
What else would you suggest?

00:27:14.596 --> 00:27:21.516
You have to delve into their problem. I would suggest checking out with a holistic

00:27:21.516 --> 00:27:25.516
practitioner, somebody on the health side, a functional medicine person,

00:27:25.756 --> 00:27:26.996
a Chinese medicine person.

00:27:27.216 --> 00:27:30.996
See if it's something you can do with your body to get things moving again.

00:27:31.316 --> 00:27:38.436
I would suggest getting into some sort of body work like qigong, tai chi, or yoga.

00:27:38.616 --> 00:27:44.096
That's going to help some mindfulness practice, maybe a meditation that's going to help.

00:27:44.336 --> 00:27:49.776
So supportive therapies, in addition to trauma therapy, for sure.

00:27:49.956 --> 00:27:54.736
And if you can get involved in a supportive community, like if you have addiction,

00:27:55.076 --> 00:28:00.216
I'm not all about AA, you definitely got to shop around and make sure that you find a good, good group.

00:28:00.316 --> 00:28:06.676
But if you can find a good group, having a place to go where you can just be yourself.

00:28:06.936 --> 00:28:09.696
You can be like, oh man, I drank today and nobody's going to say,

00:28:09.816 --> 00:28:10.856
oh, you're such a bad person.

00:28:12.396 --> 00:28:15.576
Where you can just be you and you can be accepted for who you are.

00:28:15.696 --> 00:28:17.316
That could be church even, maybe.

00:28:17.936 --> 00:28:21.676
I would find a community like that that makes all the difference in the world.

00:28:22.056 --> 00:28:27.116
Tell me, what made you go into this section about medicine, I suppose, mental health?

00:28:27.316 --> 00:28:35.316
What put you across that path? I was in business school and I was looking for an easy A.

00:28:35.889 --> 00:28:38.769
And I was like, oh, well, psychology, I should knock that out.

00:28:39.069 --> 00:28:42.489
And so I took a psychology class and then stuff just started clicking.

00:28:42.929 --> 00:28:46.789
I was bullied as a kid. I didn't understand people at all because the way that

00:28:46.789 --> 00:28:51.149
it happened with me was that there would be a kid and we're perfectly fine.

00:28:51.309 --> 00:28:54.689
We're getting along just great. And then the bell rings, see him again.

00:28:54.829 --> 00:28:59.509
And now they want to beat me up. I'm just like, oh, my God, didn't make sense to me at all.

00:28:59.849 --> 00:29:04.849
And so I wasn't I just kind of hung back from people. And I was very standoffish

00:29:04.849 --> 00:29:09.589
because I didn't know, you know, are you going to be the same the next time I see you?

00:29:09.749 --> 00:29:12.669
So it took me a really long time to warm up to people. And when I took that

00:29:12.669 --> 00:29:16.449
psychology class, it just all started to make sense. And I was absolutely fascinated.

00:29:16.929 --> 00:29:18.569
And I like things that make sense.

00:29:19.869 --> 00:29:25.349
Just to wrap this up, what's the most surprising thing you've learned about trauma?

00:29:26.149 --> 00:29:30.869
How widespread it is. Yeah. You know, when I first started, I started in domestic violence.

00:29:30.869 --> 00:29:35.069
And then I went into sexual assault and in

00:29:35.069 --> 00:29:37.869
both of those situations I had a lot of people

00:29:37.869 --> 00:29:40.689
with personality disorders and so I

00:29:40.689 --> 00:29:45.109
worked with that population the entire time and I and at first I thought it

00:29:45.109 --> 00:29:49.969
was because of the sexual assault it's because of the rate or the domestic violence

00:29:49.969 --> 00:29:56.049
and then the more that I got into it's like well no that happened but that's

00:29:56.049 --> 00:29:59.109
you know the trauma was there before in many cases,

00:29:59.129 --> 00:30:03.149
and it's a lot deeper than that. So,

00:30:03.859 --> 00:30:08.259
I think people think about it in like, oh, these people just came back from

00:30:08.259 --> 00:30:11.099
war or this person had a sexual assault.

00:30:11.259 --> 00:30:19.079
No, we live in a traumatizing society and we're creating this and we're doing

00:30:19.079 --> 00:30:24.639
this to ourselves. So when we look at the crime statistics, it's like, how am I adding to this?

00:30:25.099 --> 00:30:31.339
We don't start looking at ourselves and mindfully creating the society that we want.

00:30:31.599 --> 00:30:34.759
It's going to be dog eat dog. I mean, I think it pretty much is now.

00:30:34.959 --> 00:30:36.779
How do you keep your head bright?

00:30:37.179 --> 00:30:40.879
How do you sleep at night? I don't watch TV.

00:30:42.179 --> 00:30:45.419
I don't do pop culture. I live in the country.

00:30:45.499 --> 00:30:50.319
I have a very selected group of friends. I live a very wholesome,

00:30:50.579 --> 00:30:52.219
grounded, natural life.

00:30:52.799 --> 00:30:57.739
And if I didn't do that, I think that the things that I hear and see every day

00:30:57.739 --> 00:30:59.159
would probably drive me crazy.

00:30:59.699 --> 00:31:05.539
Laura, thank you very much for coming in. Now, I'm not going to be able to sleep at night. Sorry.

00:31:08.059 --> 00:31:12.439
Thank you very much for bringing us into another world, really,

00:31:12.519 --> 00:31:16.719
to most people. because, as I say, trauma has always been to me,

00:31:17.019 --> 00:31:21.039
someone, as you say, a car accident or a war or something's been hit over the

00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:22.999
head with a block of wood or something.

00:31:23.199 --> 00:31:28.779
But now I've got a better idea of what is a – it's like, I suppose, the word cancer.

00:31:29.419 --> 00:31:34.439
Now that word cancer is used for everything. Years ago it was only cancer was

00:31:34.439 --> 00:31:38.319
one specific thing and that was it, you know, the big C.

00:31:38.539 --> 00:31:41.339
Now it's not the big C anymore. It's the common C.

00:31:41.679 --> 00:31:45.759
Yeah. Yeah, it's the same thing. Thank you again for your time.

00:31:46.019 --> 00:31:53.499
Thank you for being with us. And it's great to, as I say, put a face to the voice.

00:31:53.799 --> 00:31:57.499
It's a pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. It's been terrific. Thank you very much.

00:31:57.939 --> 00:32:00.679
May see you again. Okay. Okay.

00:32:01.219 --> 00:32:03.199
Bye. Thank you. Bye.

00:32:04.899 --> 00:32:09.539
To our loyal listeners, thank you for listening in. And if this episode gave

00:32:09.539 --> 00:32:14.579
you something to think about, share it with someone who needs it. Have a good day.

00:32:17.459 --> 00:32:22.339
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